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Ronnie Lane Interview Part 2

by Dave McNarie

Kentish Town, 28 December 1983

L: Let's take this (phone) off.

M: Yes. Same as before.

L: Right. Where was we? I've been sittin' here all morning, and that phone hasn't rung once. YOU get here, and it don't stop!

M: Well, I attract attention, basically.

L: Well, you can piss off as well!

M: Don't worry, I will with time. How are we going to start this? Have any ideas?

Ruby: (Referring to the television) Will you turn it up, please? Turn it up.

L: Uh... I don't know how we're gonna start this. I can't remember what we've done so far.

Ruby: Will you turn it up?

L: (To Ruby) I've got to do an interview. I'm doin' an interview, Ruby. I'm doin' an interview on a tape recorder, and I don't want the noise of that to go on the tape recorder, because Salt Lake City wouldn't be very interested in Bonanza from England.

Ruby: Are you going to do an impression of me? (Pointing at tape recorder) Am I going to be on 'ere? On there?

L: Well, you will be if you keep shouting. Sorry, what was you saying?

M: Basically, I thought I'd come back and do an update once you got back (from the American A.R.M.S. tour). What fun stories do you have to tell about the tour?

L: What fun stories do I have to tell about the tour? Well, Joe Cocker was a great addition. Joe Cocker was a fantastic addition to the line-up, and he helped out greatly. Everybody had a ball. I mean, it was a magic kind of a tour. We raised $18,000 less than a million, which is now a million dollars because it's been invested, obviously (and) the interest has bumped it up to a million dollars. Also, my idea of starting an Action Research into MS in America has taken a bit of a rockin' because I don't know how to put it together properly. I mean, I know how to put one together, but I want to put a very POTENT one together, an effective one together-- not a sham, and not one that's there just to spend the money. So, I've got a little bit more research to do on all that. But it will be done! Also, I never realised when I was goin' over there, with this kind of nave idea of mine, that I was actually stepping on a political minefield!

M: Oh, really?

L: Oh, yeah!! The MS Society, they've got it all sewn up, and they don't want anybody else in there, you know? Oh, I could tell you some very strange stories! I mean, let me tell you this story: You know this HBO, this Hyperbaric Oxygen treatment, (has) basically saved my life-- mentally, for me, because I had no energy. I couldn't speak, at one stage. I , certainly, didn't have any energy to exercise, or anything, until I took oxygen under pressure. The MS Society have pooh-hood hyperbaric oxygen, and put it aside and said, "it's dangerous, it's brain damage..." It's only oxygen under pressure!! It's not a drug! I mean, they say that steroids are all right, and things like that, which (makes raspberry) blow you up to look like a hamster and all that. But, this oxygen under pressure is 'DANGEROUS', all of a sudden. I know THAT is absolute nonsense, and it's what I want to put about.

The MS society hired a doctor Fischer, back in the Seventies, to prove , once and for all, that hyperbaric oxygen is no use, whatsoever, to people with MS He worked on it for some years, and he couldn't do it. His report came out in FAVOR of the hyperbaric oxygen! They asked him to go back and write his report again. THREE TIMES they sent him back to rewrite his report! The last time he finished it was in 1980-- while I was still walkin' about. Ordinarily, I might add. They didn't rush-release the report at all, because it was in FAVOR of HBO. In actual fact, it was only released early this year, 1983! Meanwhile, I've become crippled, y'see? They've dismantled his oxygen chamber. It's now in a car park in New York! He could not prove that oxygen was no good. He could only prove that it is of some help. Don't get me wrong, it's not a cure. But, it's of great assistance for someone to keep it under control, and to live with it kind of ordinarily, y'know? Lead a bit of a life, instead of gradually becoming crippled all of the time. Anyway, that's a story about the MS Society, and it's not a very nice story. Not a very nice story at all, but it happens to be the case.

And I think it's disgusting, ya know?

M: Did the tour get enough money to open your own Hyperbaric chamber?

L: Well, we did, but my point is that we can't do it in America like we can over here. You see, we can open up our own chamber over here, where you just breathe pure oxygen through a mask. And, your relatives can learn to operate the chamber. But you won't be able to do that in America. The other (system) is where you don't need a mask, the whole chamber is full of pure oxygen (under pressure). There, you're talkin' about a BOMB, so you've got to have trained, proper technicians to run it. What I hope to do is to get something called an NMR scanner. Nuclear Magnetic Response (sic), would you believe? That is kind of an x-ray, but it's not an x-ray. But, it's such a fine instrument that it can actually take a picture of your nerves. What I aim to do is to get someone with MS and get them under this NMR scanner, and then put them through the (HBO) treatment, and then take a picture of them after. (It's) to prove it, once and for all, that HBO does help. It's not a cure, but it DOES help. I don't know. We've got a long way to go.

M: What would the main obstacle be in the States, then?

L: Finding the people, I suppose. I don't know how to find the people. Y'see, ARMS over here was CREATED by people with MS that got SO FRUSTRATED at this whole attitude towards MS-- You know, this sort of, "Well, you've got an incurable disease now. You're going to get crippled for the REST of your life, but just sit back and accept it. We've got a nice wheelchair for you out in the hall, and everything's going to be rosy. Don't make a panic, you'll upset everyone." You know what I mean?! That's what you're given. So they created ARMS, 'Action RESEARCH into Multiple Sclerosis', to try and get some absolute answers, because we got fed up. Horrible thing to say, this is, but I'm gonna say it-- It strikes me that, in a lot of cases, MS is the bread ticket for a lot of so-called "Societies" and, without it, they'd be out of a job. You know what I mean? Which makes me wonder about cancer and leukemia, y'know? I wonder. I mean, I've seen it and I know that is the case with MS, so what's happening with cancer and leukemia?

M: How many of these hangers-on are preventing a cure?

L: Absolutely! Preventing the cure, yeah. I mean, what a bread ticket cancer is!

M: I'm sure it is for thousands of people.

L: 'We can't find a cure for THAT!! Thousands of people would be OUT OF WORK!!' (laughter) 'Millions of people would be CURED, but thousands of people would be out of work!' I don't know. I don't know if I'm sounding sick, but...

M: Well, let's see... Do you have some rosy stories from the tour though? Winwood pulled out and Cocker...

L: Cocker took his place, yeah.

M: Did Paul Rodgers go over?

L: Paul Rodgers, yeah, Paul Rodgers.

M: How's he doing?

L: Oh, he's doing fine. He's a gentleman! Yeah, he went over and helped out Jeff Beck's set. Did you see the show over here?

M: No.

L: Because the video of the show over here is going to be on the telly... the TV, I suppose, in America. But it won't be like the (shows in America). It's a pity they didn't get a video of the ones in America, because that was SO good! I mean, it really was good. The Albert Hall one was good, but...

M: Yeah, I heard you on the phone. You said you didn't think that one was nearly as good as the stuff you did in the States.

L: It wasn't. Oh, no. It wasn't. The more it played-obviously, like any kind of band, the more it got together-- and, by the time we did Madison Square Garden, it was very sharp. It really was, and I wish that had been videoed.

M: You've got a video coming out. Are there going to be any albums coming out, or anything like this?

L: No, nothing like that. You know, the POLITICS of it all got in the way, as USUAL! Y'know? The SAME OLD THING. It's bureaucracy and politics. It's always the same.

M: Yeah, that's the story. How many shows did you do in the States? Was it seven?

L: I think it was nine. Let's see, there were two in Dallas, two in San Francisco, two in LA, and two in New York. Why did I say nine? That's eight, isn't it? Or was it three in San Francisco? I think it was three in San Francisco. It WAS nine. The two in Dallas financed the tour, really.

M: So everything else was just money in the pocket.

L: San Francisco, LA and New York was totally for the charity. But we are definitely going to do something... use the money for MS in America. Glyn Johns, the producer of the show, was most adamant-- and I agree with him-- that you can't raise a lot of money in one country and take it over to another. But, really, in the long run, it doesn't really matter who gets there first, because... If America finds it first or England finds it first, it's soon going to scoot across the pond. So, either country's going to benefit from it.

M: Eventually, yeah.

L: Eventually, yes, without a doubt. But I don't think there IS such a cure for MS. It is such a strange disease that I do not know how much of it is subconscious, y'know?

M: You mean that if you have a defeatist attitude, it will be worse for you.

L: Absolutely! Oh, without a doubt. Yeah, if you've got a defeatist attitude it'll certainly get you down. And, of course, the way the disease comes on, it's whole strategy is to make you FEEL defeatist. You get so WEAK. You get unbelievably weak! I mean, I've never been a STRONG man, but I never realised what 'weak' meant until I got MS, y'know? (Laughs) You haven't even got the strength to THINK straight!

M: I've had THAT lots of times, but I don't think it's the same thing.

L: Well, I don't know. It all adds up to the same thing, in the end.

M: How did it effect you? Can you describe, basically, how it's effected you from the period of time that you found out you had it, or FIGURED that you had it? Like you say, at first it was just a numb feeling here and there?

L: Yeah. A bit of double vision. A numb feeling. You kind of wonder... "I wonder what that is??" And it would go away, so you wouldn't take much notice. So, next time it came, you'd sit it out and wait for it to go away. And then the numbness, each time it comes back it's a little bit worse, a fraction worse. Y'know, it's got plenty of time to work on you. It's in no hurry to knock you down straight away. (That's) another thing that I've found, talking to people that have got it. They've all been through some kind of an emotional upheaval, like a death in the family, or they've been raped. Something horrible has happened in their life, a real emotional upheaval. And then MS appears about six months later, a year later. Y'see, I don't believe there IS a 'cure' for MS. I think a lot of it's got to do with what's up there (pointing to head).

M: Mental attitude.

L: Mental attitude, yes. And, of course, the last thing you want to hear (is) the thing that people with MS are being told: "Relax. Don't do anything. Relax. Don't worry." Y'know what I mean? "The wheelchair's in the hall, and it's awaiting you." You know what I mean? The whole thing is CRAZY! I'd say, "NUTS! You forget all that! You FUCK!" Like, "FUCK!" Y'know what I mean? Who would let somebody push their life around, where you stop looking around like it is "somebody" doing it? (You must) start FIGHTING it like it is somebody doin' it, and then I think you've got a chance of getting on top of it. But you don't just let it insidiously crawl all over you, because it certainly will. Cor! I've got a long way to go yet, but I'm gonna beat this thing. I know I am. (Pause) I think I've got the fight I've always wanted!! (Laughter)

M: Go on and describe how it ceased up your body.

L: Oh, dear, I can't remember that. Well, it started in my left arm and hand. I went to put a bass guitar on a song I wrote and I couldn't do it. I thought, "That's strange." It was really odd. It was like my arm had become a piece of dead meat that was attached to my body, y'know? It is really quite a strange disease, this one.

M: What is it? Just like the feeling when you've slept on it wrong and it's all numb?

L: Yeah! That's it! Yeah, that's it. And you go to lift it up or something and there's nothing there! All of the connections... there's no connection to it. As I said, it's like a lump of dead meat hanging off your shoulder! It's very hard to believe that that's happening to you. It's the kind of thing you'd have nightmares about, I suppose. That's another thing that happens to people with MS. Of course, they won't believe that they've got it. With me, I wouldn't believe that I'd got it.

M: "Oh, that couldn't happen to ME!" that sort of...

L: YEAH!! "It's not my kind of lifestyle, man!!" Y'know?? So I had to got through all that SHIT to come up to where I am now, which, I think, is a much healthier way of lookin' at (MS). But, My God, I would like to get something concrete together so that... I would like to think that, by the time I'm finished, if someone like (I was) seven years ago has just been told that they've got it, that they kind find out a bit more about it and how to handle it. I couldn't take it seriously, especially the attitude that I'm tellin' you about! I couldn't believe it was happening! Life's always been good to me, and I've always thought, "what a great world it is we live in." And, all of a sudden, KRCKK!, overnight it changed. You've got this thing, and people are telling you, "DON"T worry!" (Laughs). Anyway, we'll see if we can't get to the bottom of it.

M: There's no ARMS group in the States yet? Or is it just now starting?

L: It's just now starting. (The conversation breaks into a discussion on Public Service

Announcements, which are spots for charities that run for free in the States.)

I'd written a few ideas down for them to have him look at, and he was intrigued by the idea. Following is an excerpt)

L: It's a great idea! (pause). Yeah. That's all right. (Referring to my script) But I don't know how it can KILL...

M: Complications.

L: Complications. Well, you can fall down the stairs! (laughs)

M: Do you have any happy stories about what went on during the tour?

L: 'Happy Stories?'

M: Yeah, little bits of this-and-that that you really enjoyed?

L: Well... Nothing really stands out. The whole tour was happy, y'know. Everybody breezed along and enjoyed each other's company. It was magic.

M: Did you do any playing yourself?

L: I didn't do any playing. I did a couple of songs. I did Goodnight, Irene, again at the end because Eric (Clapton) wanted me to! I did April Fool off of the Rough Mix album, and I could sing it better. And I found out that I'd actually got in contact with my voice again, which was a pleasant surprise. I bought that Gretsch guitar over there. What you think of that?

M: I saw that. Looks like a new one.

L: It's not a new one! It's about a '55!

M: No, it's one I haven't seen before: It's new in THIS HOUSE!

L: Yeah. I got it in the States. She's a beauty!

M: Where'd you get that? Just buy it from a store? Who'd you get it from?

L: No, no, no. I don't know where it came from because... there was a fellow on the tour called Alan Rogan, who is a roadie for the Who. I asked him, "didn't Gretsch make a small electric guitar, something like a Gibson Les Paul, or is it my imagination?" And, he said, "Yes, they did." He said it was called... what did he say it was called? A Star... A Firebird, yeah. He said, "why, are you interested in one?" I said, "well, I'd like to see one. I could be interested in one." And he went off.

Two days later, he comes in and says, "I found one. It's called a Round Up. Would you like to see it?" I said, "Oh, no!" So, he went and got it, and that's it! And, I said, "that's fantastic!" And it is. It's just a beautiful guitar!

M: What is that? A Chet Atkins model?

L: Yeah, it is a Chet Atkins model. I wonder what's happened to him, Chet Atkins.

M: Oh, he's still kickin' around.

L: Is he? I haven't heard anything about him for years.

M: Grand Ole Opry, that sort of thing.

L: 'Grand Ole Opry?' (Laughs)

M: Are you messing around with recording songs an' all? Just little demos, here and there?

L: Oh, Yeah. Well, I haven't lately because I've been out on this tour n'all. But, come the NEW YEAR...

M: What's the next project you've got going, then?

L: Well, to make some records. I'd like to make some records now. Of course, the next project is to get walkin' again. I'm gradually, very slowly, gettin' there, but, OHH, it's a long hike! That's really, mainly what I've got on my (list). Because, until I can walk properly, I can't go on the stage. I'm not going to go on the stage in a wheelchair, which has been suggested so many times...

M: Has it?

L: Oh, I know my pride has taken a bit of a batterin', but I ain't going to go that far.

M: Are you getting your walking back, then?

L: Gradually. Yeah.

M: From the treatments?

L: Yeah, from the treatments. I had a lot of treatments in Florida, just before the tour. I had lots of oxygen, and it was that what got me through because that tour was heavy goin', y'know? I think that I PROVED that HBO works! For somebody with MS to get through that tour...!

M: Proof positive, in it's own.

L: Absolutely! And they're still having an (argument) about it! That's what amazes me!

M: Still fighting it in their own, twisted way...

L: Yeah!! Weird. Very weird.

M: Oh, yeah... Something that I found whilst I was here... (pulling out a recently purchased copy of One For The Road)

L: Oh! Yesss!

Ruby: What?

L: There's a picture of your mum!

Ruby: Where? Where? (crawling onto Ronnie's lap) Where's my mum?

L: There! That's before you was born! You was just a twinkle in my eye then!

Ruby: Where're you?

L: That's me, there!

Ruby: I didn't know you had new trousers!

L: New trousers? They're not new! They're old! That's an old boiler suit! Say 'hello' to Salt Lake City!

Ruby: Hello!

L: Well, that was very dainty, Ruby! Cor! That brings back some memories, I tell you!

M: Like what? Because, I'm going to be playing it on the radio, so you might as well go at it!

L: Oh, well... (pointing to cover of album) We made it in that barn, there. We recorded it on my mobile studio, there...

M: Is that at your farm up in Wales?

L: (Distracted by album) Huh? Yeah! That's the farm up in Wales.

M: With all the sheep?

L: With all the sheep, yeah. (pause)

M: Go ahead and list off some of the songs there that you really like.

L: What? Off this one? Well, let's have a look. It's been a long time since I've heard any of these. Side two, Steppin' and Reelin', I wrote that on my bus. Side two, track two, Harvest Home, was a number that I wrote for a lady who died. Her name was Mrs. Caulfield. She lived down the road from my farm, and she died, and it was really weird. It was very hot that summer, extremely hot. It was nighttime and, of course, in the summer it gets dark very late. I went to a pub, and someone told me she'd died. I couldn't believe it... well, I could believe it, but it knocked me about a bit. I came out of the pub and it was dark, and all of the tractors were coming up from the fields with their lights on, and their carts all filled with hay, bringing the harvest home. I was just very choked, and I went home and I wrote Harvest Home. Yup. On side one, That Burning Summer, I wrote that about that summer I was talking about. It was very hot. One For The Road speaks for itself.

M: How did you like working with Island?

L: Island Records? I didn't. I like the fellow whose the guvner, who is that?

M: Chris Blackwell.

L: Chris Blackwell, yeah. I like him, he's a good fellow. But, the people who work for the company, I knew most of them when I was in the Small Faces. They were TEABOYS, then, for the record companies. Now they're sort of the heads of Island Records. They couldn't run a piss-up in a brewery, y'know what I mean?

M: Why don't you list some of the Faces tracks that you really liked.

L: The Faces tracks... Well, I like Memphis, Tennessee. I like the way that came together, recording, too. We didn't... we didn't... (His children, playing nearby, become louder.) OI! Oi! I'm doing an interview!! Now, keep quiet, please! This is Salt Lake City! Ruben! That means you, too. Memphis, Tennessee, we really didn't intend to do it. I started messin' about with it on the bass. I was playin' my version of what I thought Lonnie Mack used to do it like. The rest of the band joined in and, all of a sudden, we just did it! Then, Rod came in and sang it. It was one of those things that came about without thinking. I like things like that. Spontaneous. I like spontaneous things. Other Faces things... Cor, dear! I can't remember much of 'em!

M: (laughing) Sure you can! You HAVE to!

L: Yeah. Cindy Incidentally, I like that, Cindy Incidentally.

(Pause)

M: How did Ooh La La come about?

L: Ooh La La was an idea of Ron Wood's. I wrote the words to that. I was just entering my 'Hating Women' stage, you know? Loving them and hating them all at the same time. I've really been through that stage, as well! I never realised when I wrote the words to Ooh La La, how relevent it was. Very strange. Everything that I seem to write either comes true or is what's actually happening, and I haven't noticed it's what's actually happening.

M: You're subconsciously writing songs.

L: Yeah! I think I'm sort of writing something out of my head and, in actual fact, all I'm doing is sort of writing down what's happening, you know?

M: Can you think of some other songs, then? Stay With Me, of course. You'd have to say something about that one, considering it was the big hit.

L: Oi! RUBEN!! I asked you to be quiet! We're making a recording to go on the radio in America! Lukie! Lukie: Yeah?

L: Leave him alone. Lukie: I'm not touching him. HE'S kicking ME.

L: Sorry, what did you ask?

M: Stay With Me

L: (Distantly) Stay With Me. Why did you ask me about that one?

M: It was a big hit, for one thing.

L: Was it? The only thing I can remember about Stay With Me is the bass line! (laughter)

M: How about Around the Plynth?

L: Around the Plynth. Now you're getting right back into the early days! (Pause)

M: Debris?

L: Oh, Debris is basically about my old man. Yeah, the Debris used to be down... not Petticoat Lane. Adjoining Petticoat Lane-- which is famous, everybody knows about it-- is another market called Club Row, and that was all on Debris. People just used to come out there with all their chuck-outs and flotsam and jetsam and spread it out on the Debris, you know? And my father used to go down there every Sunday. Every Sunday morning, he'd take me down there and he'd root around for hours in all this shit! (Laughter) And, uh, it wasn't until I was in New York that I realised that I quite missed it! I was feeling homesick at the time. (Tape change occurs here, disrupting interview)

M: Well, can you think of any other songs from your long, illustrious career? Oh! How about Rene?

L: "Rene, the Docker's Delight"? (laughs) Well, that's basically about a chick called Rene Tungate, and it's a true story, again. What more can I say? You listen to the words of "Renee, the Docker's Delight," and you've got it. I can't say no more than that! She was an old bag!! (Laughs)

M: Down at the Crown and Anchor.

L: Well, that was a bit of artistic license.

M: Couldn't say the real one, could you?

L: No!

M: That would make it too true?

L: We didn't know at the time. We weren't drinkers. We weren't drinkers at the time.

M: Good album, that was, Ogden's Nut.

L: Ogden's Nut Gone Flake. (laughs)

M: I always thought that was kind of odd, because Ogden is where I live. Ogden's the town I live in.

L: Oh, yeah? Well, that's the name of a tobacco company over here. I mean, the idea of Ogden's Nut Gone Flake was, if they ever legalised marijuana and the tobacco companies put it out, that's what it would be called. We thought of a good name for a brand of marijuana, Ogden's Nut Gone Flake. 'That's good stuff! It makes your nut go!'

(Laughter)

M: Would you call the early Rod Stewart albums just, simply, Faces albums under an incorrect moniker?

L: Pardon?

M: Do you think of them as Faces albums rather than Rod Stewart solo albums?

L: Not really, they were Rod Stewart's all right. There were things that Rod, if he'd been worth his salt, should have saved for Faces albums. But, it became obvious to me after a while that Rod was saving all his good ideas for his own albums, and very little for the Faces albums. I thought, "I've been through all this before. Steve Marriott left the boys right up the lurch, now Rod's going to leave us up the lurch. So, the only thing to do is, I'll leave first." Y'know? So that's why I left the Faces!

M: And once Tetsu got in, what was it, another year before it was all over?

L: It didn't last much longer after that.

M: It shouldn't have. Wasn't there some disturbance over Ooh La La, once it came out? Rod slammed it in the press?

L: Oh, yeah!

M: What was that about?

L: Rod slated it something rotten!

M: Why?

L: I don't know. Basically, he didn't bother to turn up for it. So we carried on recording, and when he came in to put his voice-overs on it they was in the wrong keys, things like that, for him. And he started complaining about this and complaining about that!

And, if you ask me, if he's gonna FUCKING complain, he should have been there when we recorded it, you know?! So I thought, 'Oh!! I've had enough of all this! I've been through all this with Marriott, now I'm going through it with him. So, I'll see if I can't get on without all these people!"

M: Move on down the road...

L: Yeah, right!!

M: Did you like the album, though? I thought it was a very good album.

L: Under the circumstances, it was a great album! It would have been a lot better if we'd had some assistance from Rod, I think. Y'know?

M: Well, at least you had Glyn behind you! (Laugh)

L: We had Glyn behind us. That's all we did have! We had our exuberance for our band, and we had Glyn Johns! That's what made it a GOOD album, if it is a good album.

M: I'd say it was, definitely. Why not mention some of your favourite solo stuff? If you can remember...

L: Actually, I think one of the nicest little songs that I've put together, I don't think it's been released in America. And I don't think it's on an album, either, because I was still in the nave way of thinking, 'y'know, you shouldn't put singles on albums... that's a con!' (Laugh) That's how nave I was! Anyway, it's called, The Poacher. Have you heard it?

M: Oh, yeah! Sure! It's on albums.

L: Is it?

M: Yeah. It's on Slim Chance. (At least it's on my DJ copy of it!)

L: It's on Slim Chance, is it? Well, I don't know how it got on there. It certainly didn't get on Anymore for Anymore, did it?

M: No. Say something about Poacher, then, because I've got that.

L: Well, I like The Poacher, although, if I had the chance to do it all over again, I'd like to do it all over again. And I'd like to try and SING it this time! Instead of wailing it. It's a bit high, very high, and I was scared of singing it at the time. But, in actual fact, it's not a bad song. What's another song I like? Of mine? Have you got that, See Me?

M: No. That's one I'm looking for, desperately.

L: Cuz that's got a couple of nice things on it that I like. So you can't play any tracks off of that, can you?

M: Not unless I find it, which is possible. Give it a shot! I'll find it someday, and I can use I then!

L: Right! There's a track called Ain't No Winning With Women. I told you about my hating women number! I think that was my last "hating women" song. I love ALL women, now. They're not nasty at all. It's ME that's nasty! (Laughter) And, there's also a number called, Don't Tell Me Now. I like that one.

M: How did the soundtrack with Ron Wood come about?

L: It was just a friend of mine who was an actor, called Alexis Cannon. He asked me if I'd do it, so I said, "Yes, I'm interested. Let's have a look, see what it's like." And, at the time, it was a good movie. I read the story, and it was amusing. And then I saw some shots from the movie, and I thought it had something. So, I went to Ronnie Wood, and said, "you interested, Ronnie?" And he said, "yeah."

M: Was he with the Stones at the time?

L: No. He was with the Faces. We was both with the Faces. M: You did that in 1975, though. 1974?

M: Was he with the Stones at the time?

L: No. He was with the Faces. We was both with the Faces.

M: You did that in 1975, though. 1974?

L: Did it about '72, '73.

M: Really? It didn't come out til '77...

L: Well, I left the Faces in '73, and it was in the can by '73. Yup. Getting it finished, once I'd left the Faces, was something else because Ronnie was wooing the Stones at the time. And getting him to come down to the bottom of his garden to work, to finish the album, was, uh...

M: Something just short of impossible

L: Absolutely! He would fly to Ireland to see Mick, and I was up at the bottom of the garden, like! (Laugh)

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